From Alcohol Dependency To A Life Of Clarity And Purpose w/Jen Hirst

What happens when the path to self-discovery is paved with the challenges of addiction? Join us for a compelling conversation with Jen Hirst, the inspiring founder of the Lighthouse Society. 

Jen candidly shares her journey from battling alcohol addiction, initially as a misguided remedy for anxiety and emotional turmoil, to finding her way to sustainable sobriety. Her story not only shines a light on the hidden struggles many face but offers hope and tangible strategies for those ready to embrace change. Through her experiences, Jen highlights the importance of self-reflection and understanding one’s usage history as a crucial step toward recovery.

Discover the power of storytelling and gratitude as we discuss the transformative impact of sharing one’s journey in recovery. Together, Jen and I explore how small, consistent habits, such as drinking more water and practicing gratitude, can lead to profound personal growth. 

Drawing inspiration from Rachel Hollis, we emphasize the importance of specificity and reflecting on recent experiences to cultivate a positive outlook. Through personal anecdotes, we highlight the entwined challenges and triumphs of maintaining a positive mindset in sobriety, reinforcing that while recovery is simple, it is by no means easy.

In our conversation, we also navigate the complex landscape of establishing boundaries for emotional sobriety and achieving physical wellness. Jen introduces us to Mel Robbins' "Let Them" theory, advocating for inner peace by releasing control over others while clarifying the active need for setting boundaries. 

We venture into the intersection of sobriety, nutrition, and wellness, offering practical strategies to overcome common hurdles like sugar cravings. By integrating gratitude and community support, we provide a holistic approach to wellness that nurtures both physical and emotional well-being, empowering individuals on their path to sustainable sobriety.

You can find Jen on her website www.joinlighthousesobriety.com or
Instagram: @jenleehirst

Oh and by the way if you are ready to learn more about how remote Neurofeedback therapy can help you with ADHD, sleep problems, anxiety or performance issue, grab my free download Is Neurofeedback Therapy Right For you? And let me know what you think. 

Chapters

• 0:00 Sustainable Sobriety
• 13:04 Building Recovery Through Sharing and Gratitude
• 17:07 Cultivating Gratitude and Personal Responsibility
• 25:40 Establishing Boundaries for Emotional Sobriety
• 37:25 Achieving Physical Wellness in Sobriety

Transcript

Shelby: 0:00

Hey there, sober ladies, thank you so much for joining me today and I have a conversation that you're going to love. My friend, jen Hurst, is with us today and she is the founder of Lighthouse Society. She tells her story in such a great way and how she helps women through coaching and using six simple steps to make society sobriety sustainable from day one. So she is just a breath of fresh air. Truly, she gets down and dirty about things like boundaries and gratitude. We really just share back and forth about habits and the importance that we have of layering on tools to help sustain not only our sobriety but also just our well-being and our health and physical health and our mental health and just we go through a couple of those things. I think you're really going to enjoy it and leave with some real practical tools that you can implement literally today and help make a big difference in your life. So grab your big glass of water or your favorite mocktail and enjoy this conversation with Jen.

Shelby: 1:02

First, hello and welcome to the Confident Sober Women podcast. I'm your guide, shelby John. I'm the mother of three, wife to one and sober since July 1st 2002. As sober women, we have something huge in common and when we share our lives and our stories with each other, we feel that sense of belonging and connection, so we know we are no longer alone. In this podcast, you will hear real life talk about building confidence and transforming your life beyond recovery. So come on, let's talk.

Shelby: 1:50

Hey, it's me Shelby. Have you ever wondered what's really happening in your brain during recovery? Are you ready to take control of your anxiety, sleep better and finally feel focused and confident? I want to introduce you to a game changer that's transforming women's recovery remote neurofeedback therapy. I want you to think of this as a personal trainer for your brain. It's helping you build new neuropathways right from the comfort of your own home. So if you're dealing with anxiety that just won't quit, if you have ADHD that's making life chaotic, or sleep issues that leave you exhausted, neurofeedback could be your missing piece. It's science-backed brain training that works with your natural healing process, helping you regulate emotions and build lasting confidence. The best part is, you don't need to add another appointment to your busy schedule. My remote neurofeedback program brings professional guidance and support right to your living room. Do you want to learn more about neurofeedback therapy?

Shelby: 2:55

You can go to my website wwwshelbyjohncom to download my free guide. Is Neurofeedback Right for you? Together, we'll create the calm, confident future you that you deserve. That's wwwshelbyjohncom. Take the first step towards training your brain for lasting change. Well, hey there, jen. Thank you so much for joining me today for the Confidence Over Women podcast. I'm so excited to have you and to share you and your story with our guests, so I'm going to turn the mic over to you. Let you share a little bit more about your story, and then we're going to chat?

Jenn: 3:35

Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much for having me on. As she mentioned, I am Jen Hurst and I am a sober coach, mother of two. I live in northern Minnesota and I've been sober for 11 and a half years and I coach women on not only how to boost your confidence in sobriety, but also implementing habits from the get-go to have you feeling your best throughout this process. And so my story goes into. You know, I really like to say no one is off limits.

Jenn: 4:05

I didn't look like your typical if we use the term alcoholic or someone who has a problem. I don't really have pictures of me passed out or in bed. I did my drinking alone and, from the looks of it, if you go to my Instagram page, I was. It looks like I have it all together. It wouldn't look like I have a problem. I was really good at hiding it and if we go on a spectrum, I was one of the more severe cases where I didn't know if I had days left to live. It was how far I took it and how much I wanted to make something work. That just wasn't supposed to, and my background is I was raised in a great family, as I'm sure many of you are. My parents rarely drank, I got good grades, and so I didn't fit the typical mold of someone who would be struggling with alcohol. But I think, especially for me, I used it to manage my anxiety. It went from pain, from heartbreak, and I only learned that by doing a usage history. If no one's ever done that, it was really eye-opening. I encourage everybody to do that.

Jenn: 5:09

Or I kind of pinpointed where my drinking went from fun quote unquote fun to using it to manage an emotion or using it to escape, and that started when my second boyfriend wanted to go on a break, and so that implemented the seed that I could take away any hard feeling by drinking. I never had to feel fear, I never had to feel sadness, I never had to feel, you know, just anxious in social situations, and so it wasn't like I was addicted right off the gate, and so it wasn't like I was addicted right off the gate. Going through my history, it was about 10 years of where I first started to escape and abuse it to when I actually got sober. And so this is why alcohol is so tricky. It's because often you wake up and you don't even realize what's happened and how you got here, until you kind of back it up and kind of go through your story and figure it all out and how you used it to manage feelings, how that increased my anxiety, and then I would drink because I was anxious. And I was anxious because I drank and so I kept pushing and pushing.

Jenn: 6:16

It got worse and worse and I got many consequences. I've had two DWIs. Yeah, I was laid off from my job. I got my car taken away. I was drinking other forms of alcohol, like mouthwash, rubbing alcohol to reduce the shame that I felt from walking into a liquor store. I was trying everything that I could to hide it.

Jenn: 6:37

And it was really in the year leading up to my wedding where kind of everything came about. I was working full time, doing freelance-time, and I was crippling with anxiety, and so it was really in the day after my wedding I kind of collapsed and began the year and a half journey of actively seeking sobriety. And I'm super stubborn. If you tell me something that I can't do, I'm going to prove to you that I can do it. And I couldn't do this and I didn't know why. I would have certain milestones, like 30 days, and I couldn't do this and I didn't know why I would have certain milestones like 30 days and you know, I don't even think I reached 60 days in that year and a half journey, but it was trying things out and seeing what worked. I have been to three inpatients, I've been to eight outpatients, I've gotten a therapist, I've gotten a psychiatrist, I've been to jail, I've been to house arrest, I've been to all of these things, but I kept having to push it until I was finally done. I didn't have a car, I didn't have a home, my marriage was on the verge of divorce, I had no money and I didn't know if I was going to wake up the next day. And so it was in detox, where I was going for the second time that I kind of had an out of body experience. And maybe your listeners have this click moment which I always refer to. We kind of wake up and everything becomes clear and I didn't want to drink anymore and I just stopped fighting it.

Jenn: 7:56

And I can't say that everything was perfect. I had so much stuff to clean up, I had court the next day, I didn't have any money, I was homeless, I was all of this. But I just told myself as long as you don't drink. You can't make this any worse. And I didn't know what my life was going to be like. I didn't know how I was going to clean up the mess that I created, but I just kept focusing on the next right thing. And it's amazing that, even with all this stuff that I had to do get a parole officer, all of it, get my license back, all of this stuff, get a job, like everything it was so much easier when I accepted it and I was ready to do this, and I didn't have to hide anything. I didn't have to manage the lies that I was keeping and it was so. It was like this huge weight.

Jenn: 8:44

And I can also say that no one believed me when I got sober. How was it? How were they supposed to know that this time was going to be different? So it took them and my husband actually did a podcast a couple months ago that it took him almost a couple of years to actually trust me again. So I didn't try to persuade them, I just showed up and I walked the talk. Didn't try to persuade them, I just showed up and I walked the talk. I went to my meetings, I got my sponsor, I did my outpatient, I did this, I did that, I did this, and it's amazing what can happen when you're sober that all I was doing was not consuming this one thing, and in turn, I got so much back. I was able to rebuild my life. Within four months.

Jenn: 9:26

We found out we were pregnant with my first son, which is what I've always dreamt about, and we couldn't have kids because I couldn't even take care of myself, and so my drinking was preventing us from even doing that, and the fact that my body could recover enough to produce a life just blew me away, and so, from that moment forward, I wanted to treat it with respect. It was in my son, who was born right before my one year soberversary, because he was a preemie. He was the greatest gift to come from my sobriety of something to look forward to. I'm not saying everybody go out and get pregnant, but it was just one of the miracles that can happen when you start treating your body with some respect, and within four months, I got a job back in my field. Within six months, I was promoted. Within a year, less than a year, my son was born. Within a year and a half, we got our first house and all of these good things start happening. And I'm not saying life was perfect, but I was living it.

Jenn: 10:31

I was actually living it and I was able to notice all the good things that were happening. And so, from that moment forward, I'd been in graphic design and I never shared about my sobriety. And it was when I became a beach body coach If anybody is familiar with that, which is something completely out of the ordinary One of those things is to share your story, which I did not do. I did not share anything. I actually didn't even think anybody cared about my sobriety. I was really living a dry, drunk lifestyle. I didn't share about it. I didn't think anybody cared. I felt like I had no friends, and this was for about four years. I lived in the sober closet, and part of that is sharing your story if you become a coach. So, within a couple of weeks of me starting that feeling uncomfortable, putting myself out there, I thought it was time to come out of the sober closet, and so I have two recovery dates I have April 24th of 2013, which is my sober date, and I have September 7th of 2017, which was the day I came out of the closet, which also changed my life, because from that moment forward, it led me over the course of a few years, to realize I don't think I'm supposed to help women lose weight. I think I'm supposed to help them get sober. Something that I'm doing is working from workouts to reading to water, like all of that stuff. What I'm doing is working and women want to know about it because they're struggling.

Jenn: 12:03

So I started getting in my DMs and, slowly but surely, stars started to align and it became clear like this is what I was meant for, and so I began. I started coaching private clients, while still having a full-time job with two kids under three trying to make it work. I then wanted to go into group coaching because that's like the magic of sobriety is community is we all help and support each other. You have to have a sober community. That is, hands down, non-negotiable. You got to be with other women who are also doing the same thing as you, who can lift you up in a society that pushes alcohol, and we all do this thing together, we all get sober together, we all support each other and we all focus on taking care of ourselves in this process. And so those groups took off and then in turn, grew by membership and it's just kind of dominoed from there, and that's kind of how I got to where I am today. In a nutshell, a little bit.

Shelby: 13:04

Jen, thank you so much for sharing all of that in such a vulnerable way.

Shelby: 13:08

And you're so right what you said, that you know where the magic really happens is when we begin to come out of the closet. As you said, now, not everybody's designed for openly sharing publicly about all of the things, and that's not necessary, but if you can find a space whether it's recovery meetings or in, like you know, groups that you feel comfortable with, or even with just a trusted friend or family member, sharing those parts of yourself is really, really an important process. And also, again, like you don't have to write the book or start a blog about all your transgressions or whatever, but, um, find some way to be a resource and to share the magic and the hope that comes in recovery, because that is truly how it works. Right, that's what we learned that when other people hear you know about you or me or whoever, and they're like, oh my gosh, how did you do that? Like, how did you stop? Like I knew you, you know like you were like falling out or whatever, and like, how did you stop?

Shelby: 14:09

You know, so that's how the message of hope gets spread and like we let other women know, like actually it is possible to change your life and it's not as it's actually hard, I mean it's not, it's very simple. You know, this is very, very simple stuff, Not always easy, but it is simple. So thank you so much for sharing, because that's what it's all about and I appreciate that. I love how you really talked about the transformation. Really that came from not just not drinking, you know. I mean, obviously, if substances are a part of your problem, then not drinking and using is going to be the first step and probably the most critical part. But the transformation comes when we start to combine and like layer on all of these other things that build an of like a complete package in tiny little steps, Like so tiny little increments we add in, we layer on these tools that lead to the big transformation.

Shelby: 15:09

Right, so from 2000, I think you said 13, maybe all the way until now, I mean, you started putting in these little things, little tiny things, over time and we think that's stupid. Like what does drinking water have to do with anything? This is ridiculous. But like, and you add that every single day and you never deviate. And then all of a sudden, now, like a year later, you know you have clear skin and you have healthy nails, and your hair is growing and your and your digestive tract is working properly all because you followed that one tiny little thing, and probably a bunch of other stuff too. So that's how it works.

Jenn: 15:41

You know, we do those same tiny things every single day right, yeah, and you just continue to work at it and things that may sound just like gratitude. That's one of my habits and, yeah, water. But once you learn the science behind it and how important it is, especially for sobriety take, for instance, gratitude, where, especially me going into it, I'm like, come on, this is such a waste of time. But then, especially in sobriety, I was very negative in the first four to five years of having this negative mindset, glass half empty sort of mood, and I think if we can sit in there, we can think that sobriety is not worth it, that it's boring, that there's no good can come from it, no one's ever going to like me, I have no friends. It's not fun, but gratitude really rewires your brain and it really and it's hard. I mean for me it was really hard, maybe for others it's really easy. For me I had to actually Google what do you be grateful for? I have no idea and I'm like it's easy to say your health, your family, food. But I noticed a big difference is when I got specific of and Rachel Hollis came out. If you don't know her, she has a podcast, she has books. I was into her when she came out, went to her conference changed my life and she has this Start Today journal where she listed five things she's grateful for from the past 24 hours.

Jenn: 17:07

And when I started doing that, when I really got specific and I had to do that every single day, that is where everything started changing. And not overnight, it's really over time. Making it a small habit every single morning, or whether it's at night, you end, cap your day or you start your day with it. I always recommend starting your day with it and you look back and you're like what went well and it could be the smallest little things, and knowing that you have to do that every single day, what good came from yesterday, what went well, instead of always thinking what went wrong, this and this. They said this.

Jenn: 17:44

It's like man, I was really excited that Walmart had one bag of skinny pop left, because if that didn't happen, I would be a pissed, I'd be upset. I mean again, I'm not going to die, but I guess. But noticing those little things, those little signs that we miss when we're drinking. Then, knowing you have to do it, you're going to be on the lookout to find those things every single day and be like I need to make a mental note to remember that for tomorrow. Oh my God, it's 20 degrees in Minnesota. That's so nice. The sun is out, or my dog is feeling better, or a fresh cup of coffee from Starbucks, you know. Just those things can just again rewire our brain to feel happier and more solidified in this decision that we've made. That was just one I couldn't do a few more.

Shelby: 18:36

And that is actually a practice that I have been, I think, involved in since the beginning probably, but have gotten so much better at over time, right, so over the particularly the last 10 years. But you're right, like I also can relate to being just. I mean, I was never necessarily a negative person, but maybe I was. Maybe other people would say that, but I think I just I was very so self-centered. You know, that is the root of our problem, and that self-centeredness always came out with like, like, like, oh my God, like I have too much to do, like how am I going to get this done? Like I have to do this and this and this and this. And I was, like always overwhelmed because I was just constantly listing out all of this stuff in like a negative connotation, right, as if it was like they were bad things, things.

Shelby: 19:21

But really, um, well, what? Two things happened. One, I I got sober today. So, like, um, I was heavily involved for a long time and I had a really good my second sponsor. I chose her because she was a super, really tough woman like I needed, uh, at that stage, and I remember I needed a very strong, tough woman because that's just where I was and so I remember calling her and I was like in the, I was at the, I I have three kids in four years, right.

Shelby: 19:45

So like you had six months sober, I got pregnant with my first kid. Then I had three kids in four years, so I was raising these babies and it was always just a lot and sitting in the parking lot of the gym where we, by the way, also went to preschool and we were on the swim team and like we spent two hours a day there, right. So privileged, amazing, wonderful thing. And I'm like crying the blues because I didn't know how I was going to get all of this stuff done. And like I, you know, I'm telling her, I'm listening out, and she said stop doing that, stop listing out all of those things like that, because now you've probably told me, you probably told your mom you probably called your husband, you told your friend at the gym, like you've said, that all like six or seven times.

Shelby: 20:22

Well, no wonder you feel overwhelmed no wonder your brain is flooding with cortisol. You have to stop that and start just saying what do I need to do next?

Shelby: 20:31

what is the next thing take your groceries home and unload them and then go pick up your kid, like, okay, and so when I, when it is so simple, right, like this is a simple concept, and I was actually pissed off at her because I'm like, no, you don't get it, but she did get it, she did get it, same things and I learned, like she's not, she's so right, and I needed to just stop the self-centered wheel right and slow down, because all of those things are luxury problems. Right, these are all luxury problems that I'm dealing with, instead of saying I get to go home and put my groceries away in a warm house that has air conditioning and heat and a refrigerator and four bedrooms, and then I get to go pick up my kids at a preschool that I get to send them to because we have money for that. You know? You see what I'm saying.

Shelby: 21:18

Like yeah, like when you change, when you start to change your perspective. But for me I had to have somebody really teach me that you know. I mean, he did it for me too, cause we talk about inventory just like you said. Right, we take inventory and it says even in the big book that inventory isn't only supposed to be in red, you're supposed to have things in the black. Where's the good? Well, you know what?

Shelby: 21:39

I showed up on time to work today. You know, and you seem like stupid things, but they're not stupid when you've been living a lifestyle where you couldn't even get out of bed, where you couldn't show up for things or you said lies all the time.

Jenn: 21:50

So or even driving your kids to driving your kids. The luxury of being able to drive, having a license Right, oh yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Now I loved doing that inventory part was what really helped me was what, looking at what my part was in it, how was I like dishonest, like what didn't I say? And I was like, oh man, turning the tables, I'm like, ah, because we can find so much resentment at this and this and this, it's like, well, what was my part in this and that's I felt like was really helpful for me going through that as well, if anyone has the most important part and I feel like, frankly, just an overarching theme of personal responsibility.

Shelby: 22:36

I believe is a huge part of the missing link in our society today with all people and why we have such a crisis for many people, especially young people, because they aren't being taught those kinds of things for a variety of reasons, right and so, and even adults like so.

Shelby: 22:49

Then people just constantly want to point the finger, we want to point the finger, point the finger, but there's always, there's always our part, always in everything, even good or bad. Right and so you know, like even when my kids, who are older now, like you know, they would come home and say like they're having this friendship problem or this teacher thing, and especially it was a friend thing and it was a conflict, and I'd say, well, what was your part in that? What did you say first, why didn't say I'm like, let's back it up. Like, why did she say that to you? You know, because and it's not to shame or blame, but it's to help highlight that we all are having a part. If you get pulled over because you were speeding and you went past a speed trap, the guy pulls you over, it's not because he's being a jerk. It's because he said you were speeding which is by the way, against the law.

Shelby: 23:37

So you got caught doing something that was against the law. That's your fault, it's not. He's a jerk.

Jenn: 23:49

It's not, he doesn't like white guys and black cars or whatever Like it's. Because you were speeding, yeah, and it's hard. It's hard to. It's so easy to blame other people for our problems, but it's so hard to be like I know. No, it's not fun. No, it's everybody else's problem, it's not mine.

Shelby: 24:00

Absolutely so. I love it. So already we've highlighted two really important things that I think are super critical skills that we need to layer on when we're starting to build the confidence and emotional sobriety, and that is gratitude. The other part about gratitude I wanted to just mention is Ann Voskamp's book 1,000 Gifts, and if you haven't read it it's a little tiny book. It's got a bird's nest on the front with like a blue bird. She, Ann Voskamp, is a beautiful Persian woman. She wrote this amazing book about she has like all these kids on like a homestead, you know, and she just talked about. Her friend challenged her to write down 1,000 things she was grateful for or whatever. So she started writing stuff down 1,000. She wrote a book about it, right?

Jenn: 24:39

Wow.

Shelby: 24:39

And she shares simple stories. Like you know, she's got all these kids in there and she's doing the. You know she's in the kitchen and they're fighting and blah, blah, blah, blah behind her and she's starting to, she's starting to feel it, right, she's starting to feel like, oh, here we go, and then she's, and then what she immediately does is she stops, she stops herself and she's washing her dishes and she and she's looking out her window and she's like know, thank you so much for this for these kids, thank you so much for the fact that we have a table they can sit around and fight at, thank you for these dishes that I get to wash because I have this beautiful life. So, and then, immediately, her whole body would like start to shift and slow down and she could feel that, um, disengagement of emotion, right so that is the science I'm not a scientist, but that is the science.

Shelby: 25:24

I'm not a scientist, but that is a physical response to an activity that you can literally do privately. Nobody even has to know you're doing it. That's going to change the entire way that you feel and then likely, the way you respond.

Jenn: 25:38

So yeah, that's so crazy yeah.

Shelby: 25:40

The second thing we talked about was personal responsibility, which I think is so huge and a missing, missing link. And when, when we get really good at this, the sobriety, and maybe you work with your clients on this like when you start to really own that, like, what about this situation is bothering me? You know, like I'm in this conflict and I'm feeling this thing and my husband's coming at me and he's coming at me, he is coming at you, but like, why is that bothering you? Like, why, like, why are you getting? Well, maybe it's because I feel like my security is being threatened or I'm I'm not valuable or I'm being disrespected. You know, like, what about it is bothering you?

Shelby: 26:12

right because people are allowed to have emotions around us. They're allowed to be mad, they're allowed to be sad, they're allowed to be. You know all the things but, why is that bothering you?

Jenn: 26:24

Yeah, yeah, and definitely some opportunity for some journal questions, because whatever that is happening, if it's affecting you, the same thing could be effect, or he could say the same thing to someone else that has no effect, and that one. The key concept that I love, that I've been using recently with my clients, is just the let them theory of and I think, gosh, it's just. I mean working with a client last week of being frustrated over a partner and he's doing this and he I'm like, go, you guys listen to Mel Robbins let them theory. Go buy the book, go listen to it.

Jenn: 26:59

It's so, so helpful in sobriety of releasing our need to control other people, letting them be who they are, but also let me do whatever I need to do to center myself, find gratitude and take care of myself. It releases so much anger and frustration over and offers us peace. When we release the need to try to control other people, then we invite the opportunity for peace. Time and space, like all of that stuff, can come when we just use two simple words. It's so, so helpful for me and my clients.

Shelby: 27:39

I'm reading it right now and it's like all I can talk about that work. For about 10 years, though, I really been doing it like for myself, and it just gets better and better and better and better. But now reading it, like reading her actual words gosh, it's just like freaking life changing. So definitely get Mel Robbins book, let them listen to our podcast, whatever you need to do to connect with that theory, because it is freeing, it is the key to freedom and peace. Truly because, truly, because, truly like again, like everybody around us in our country and our homes or whatever they're allowed to do and be who they want to be now, it's not without consequence. You know, nothing is. We all have consequences, good and bad, for everything that we do but, you get to, you get to be whatever you want to be.

Shelby: 28:18

That doesn't mean you will have every single benefit you know, or that people won, people won't, won't want to, you know, not be your friend, um, but you still get to do it, um, so people get that confused, I think Right.

Jenn: 28:30

Yeah.

Shelby: 28:30

He was like but I, but I'm this thing, you know, I want, I want, I want to be there, believe this or have this feeling, and but then everybody else is going to just embrace that and I'm like, no, that's not, they're not mutually exclusive. It's just, you do get to do that, but there are always consequences for our choices.

Jenn: 28:46

Yeah, absolutely Absolutely, and I also like to differentiate. You know what? How the let them theory is different than boundaries, how they're kind of similar, but also how they're different, which I don't. I know she doesn't go into the book, but when something disrupts your wellbeing, when someone disrupt or disrespects you, that is the time to not just let them right we're not going to let people walk all over us but also that's the opportunity to set a boundary and to stick up for yourself of what you will and will not accept. So let them is kind of passive and the boundaries is very active, but you can use them in conjunction with each other as you go about this to again find peace, but also be assertive with yourself and communicate what you need, which then, in turn, gets your needs met, teaches other people how to treat you, but also allows them to have their own journey and be who they are, while you're also showing yourself and doing the same for you.

Shelby: 29:46

I totally agree with you and I think that she I mean, I'm so glad you brought that up. It's a great topic. I would love to just say more, a little bit. I want us to say a little bit more about that because I think that it is confusing. You know, we hear things like let them, but I do think in the beginning of the book and I'm just still in the beginning she talks about that a little bit. She doesn't use the word boundary, but that's why she brings in the let me piece. Right, so it's.

Shelby: 30:07

And I I was just having this conversation earlier today and I said, you know, we do get to, we let them do whatever, like if somebody, if your spouse, wants to be mad or this or that, like there, we can let them do that and we can carry on with our lives and do that now. But then when it crosses, if something crosses over to like personal criticism or someone's really, you know, kind of personally attacking you or threatening you or doing other things, that's when you do need to say like, then that's let me. Well, let me speak up and say actually that's not acceptable.

Shelby: 30:34

You crossed the line here. So, yes, we can let them have their feelings, but we can also let ourselves say, actually, I don't, that doesn't, that's not going to work for me.

Jenn: 30:44

Yeah.

Shelby: 30:44

Yeah, I think that's so critical Right, and so boundaries is like another. That's another step right. That's another piece of this puzzle on, like, how we're building emotional sobriety, and I'd love to hear, like, how are you working with your clients to teach them boundaries?

Jenn: 30:58

Yeah, well, honestly, looking at different areas where you can have boundaries I mean, a lot of the boundaries we have is with ourself and where you put yourself, what time you choose to leave. You know retreating to the bedroom if something's bothering you, you know it can be with other people, it can be with your time event, like all of these different areas. But I like to help women work through the boundaries by having like a five-step process of you know identifying an area in your life that's causing you some problems that you want to change, and then working through them of okay, we have this. Then let's figure out the dialogue. Here are some different scenarios of whether you use the I statement and then how to communicate it, like when we're communicating our boundaries, how to have you know our body posture not over describing or simplifying our boundaries and then making sure we repeat them and that we follow through on them. Because with every boundary that you set, there's going to be a consequence of if that boundary is broken, what will be the consequence that you set there's going to be a consequence of if that boundary is broken, what will be the consequence. So, just navigating that, giving them a worksheet to figure that out like plan it out, because I think that's the whole key to sobriety is just to have a plan to what is bothering me. Let's write out how can I communicate this, what's going to be the consequence and what is the action that I'm going to take. Because that's exactly what boundaries are. It's the action that you take, not someone else. It's what you are going to do, and then it's up to me to withhold it.

Jenn: 32:29

And so I like to always tell clients because I'm Minnesota, nice, and to have it be received better is to do like a compliment boundary sandwich, where you say something nice to the person to kind of introduce the boundary, then you state what the boundary is and then you leave it with something positive. So you know, hey, honey, I really enjoy spending some time with you and reconnecting and watching a movie together on Friday night. What I really need is, because I'm doing this challenge, I really need to have the alcohol out of the home. So I was seeing would you be okay with if we can keep the alcohol in the garage for right now until I feel a little bit more comfortable? But I am so excited to you know, and then just leave it with something positive that makes them, the receiver, more apt to be okay and not like it's. It's up to them. It's not our responsibility with how they receive our boundary, but it's just a nicer way to kind of communicate it as people. Pleasers for them for us to get the confidence to share it.

Shelby: 33:34

Holidays, too, like and I think a lot of times, women that I've run across when I talk about this concept in any of my work is um, sometimes I feel like they don't even feel like they they're allowed to do that, like, so like we need to help them understand that, to give them permission, like they need to give themselves permission to create these boundaries, so not only do they not really know what that is, but they're not even like, oh, like I can't imagine.

Shelby: 34:01

It's like saying that to my mom or whatever you know, but I'm like okay, you know, and and we have to be very cautious we're not saying you should be a jerk, you know you don't call someone a name or like a girl. You know it's very basic, just like you just said, and and then also being willing to accept on the other side that that person might be upset about that they might be angry, they might be sad, they might be disappointed.

Shelby: 34:21

There might be a feeling that comes up for that other person because you set a boundary, but it's not you that's causing it, because that's on them, that's not your fault, right. So it's like, and then also realizing they're allowed to have maybe think of the holidays, right. So a lot of people I was working with you just struggle, like I think it's just a real struggle for most of us, especially if you're a parent, like you know, with a lot of activities, a lot of family stuff and like traveling, if you have family out of town and so. So sometimes this is really hard to be able to decide like I don't really want to do this this thing anymore, like I don't want to go out on Christmas day, like it's just you know, and so you know you struggle, you struggle, maybe do it a couple of years and then you build a resentment because now you're, like I, really pissed off.

Shelby: 35:03

But so being able to say like hey, mom, dad, you know I just I love spending time with you guys, it's so fun. Like I love our traditions and all I also am really excited about starting my own with my family and my kids, and like I really want them to be able to wake up in their, in their own home, and so we really decided that we're going to create this new kind of family nutrition for us and spend like a couple hours and then we'll come over, you know, a little bit later, maybe like two o'clock or something. So, because we really do want to spend time with you, yes, perfect.

Shelby: 35:33

Like you've been able to say, like you're valuable, I'm also valuable and I'm doing this and then. But we still really want to do it. So it's not like you're saying now sometimes you might be saying I'm not going to come but like if you can figure out a way to make, you know, make everybody get a little bit of the pie, then that works the best. But it's worse when we just let that stuff continue on when it's making, when it's hurting us, you know.

Shelby: 35:58

I mean like it's still going to be hurtful to you if you're doing something that is really not aligned with your values.

Jenn: 36:05

Yeah, and, like you said, when we don't set boundaries, that builds resentment and resentment is not a good place to be in sobriety. And when that stuff festers we get upset, we get angry and then that can push us to the F it button. So we don't want that. But, like you said, there can be a nice way to say it, how we say it matters. We don't have to explain everything. We keep it simple, we smile, we write it down if that helps, and we communicate it and then we follow through. But again, like you said, we are not responsible for how someone receives that. That's where we can apply the let them theory.

Jenn: 36:38

If they are upset by the boundaries that you set, it's even more reason to set those boundaries in the first place. And so shame and guilt can be a normal symptom after we set a boundary. That's normal. But don't let that negate you from sticking up for yourself, because you matter, your needs matter, and the more that you can gather up the confidence. So, whether that's to go for a workout, before you do it, say some affirmations to yourself, take a deep breath and look at yourself in the mirror. Just say you know what. I'm not going to die, I can freaking do this and then go and set it and then again let it go, however they receive it. It's not your responsibility, but all that's required of you is to set the boundary in the first place.

Shelby: 37:25

Yeah, so I know that one of your big areas of interest and focus is a lot around like nutrition and wellness and movement and all of those things are such important layers as well, and you know we probably could spend another two hours talking additionally about all that stuff.

Shelby: 37:41

But I'm curious about kind of the stuff that we've already, we've already said and then just bringing in that new layer of like, how do we you use the word respect your body, which I love that you know, because I think first you know, when we're active addiction, when we were an active addiction, we're doing the opposite of that Like right, Like we don't think about it, because we're not thinking about it, but like when you're doing, when you're drinking and doing drugs like you're, you're literally ingesting poison, like you're right, and so that's clearly not a way to respect your body, but we're certainly not thinking about that because we don't, because it's too much for us, we don't want to think about what we're doing but, now as, like sober people and maybe this is the first time you're ever doing that, maybe you've never been taught about nutrition, maybe you really have zero idea, like, how to even get started, or you weren't raised in a family that you know that, valued that, and that's okay.

Shelby: 38:32

Everyone has to start somewhere. And so I'm curious about like kind of the baby steps into some of that, like whether you've been a house nut for your whole life or you're kind of just baby stepping into it, like how can we bring these other concepts in, like around gratitude, even, and around personal responsibility, for sure, and then even boundaries, to like at layering on the sort of nutrition and movement aspects of physical health into our emotional sobriety recovery? Like what do you do with your clients with that?

Jenn: 38:58

Yeah, and maybe I have my clients bite off more than they can chew, but I really feel like the women that join me want a challenge and I I have my clients bite off more than they can chew, but I really feel like the women that join me want a challenge and I think when you have something and you have these habits, you have these systems set in place. I think having this challenge helps fill the time, it gives us structure, a sense of accomplishment, and they also help boost our dopamine, and so it's not something that's unachievable. It's definitely achievable, but you get to choose kind of what path you take, and so I would say, if you're interested in nutrition now that's not one of my habits, but of course, drinking water is a little bit part of nutrition and staying hydrated but if you're interested in nutrition, especially in sobriety whether you're new to sobriety or a few years in I think one of the biggest concerns that I receive in my groups is sugar cravings is all the amounts that I can't get a hold of my sugar, which is totally normal. I get it. I like to be realistic with the women. Instead of taking something away, I always ask what can we add? And the biggest thing that we can add, especially for women who are in your 30s and 40s, 50s, 60s, is to add protein. Protein helps reduce our sugar cravings, it helps manage our blood sugar, and so really having that before your trigger hour, before that witching hour, so around 3 pm usually is to have a really rich protein snack. Rich protein snack, so cottage cheese, greek yogurt, um, chomp stick, uh, just any. Anything with some protein, along with a healthy fat, is going to be really, really helpful, you know.

Jenn: 40:31

And whether it's movement, can I get out for a 10 minute walk? You know, adding in and maybe not biting off and doing all of these things at once, but it's for this week or for the next couple weeks. Can I go for a 10 minute walk? Can I write and think of three things and get a gratitude journal, three things that I'm grateful for from the past 24 hours?

Jenn: 40:53

Another one of my habits is reading, and I think reading is huge. So, whether you're listening to a podcast like this or whether you're reading a book on personal development or quitlet, I think that's imperative and has completely changed my sobriety, completely changed my mindset. So make sure you're reading. You know, maybe five pages or two pages of quitlet or a personal development book, like the let them theory or the five second rule, or you are a badass or something like that, something that's going to help you do life better and that's going to help your mindset. So I think, just taking a little bit, not over committing yourself, but thinking realistically what can I accomplish and what is one thing I could do this week that would help me to feel better?

Jenn: 41:42

So in my courses our habits are number one stay sober. Drink half your body weight in ounces of water, move your body for 30 minutes a day, read 10 pages of a personal development or quitlet book, write five things you're grateful for from the past 24 hours and check into the group. So check into your sober community every single day and when you can do those things because, again, we have the time and it doesn't take that much time when we can stack those habits together. They help you to feel better in sobriety, they help to boost your confidence, boost your self-esteem and help you to stay sober. And so you can pick and choose what habits you want to do. But if you need some recommendations, I would start there.

Shelby: 42:26

I love that so much. Those are all super powerful. And again, sometimes I know I know cause, I know how I am I'm still like so type A and just like ADHD all over the place. And like when I and I've been, I was raised as like an athlete and I was always very athletic and fit and focused on food and there's been times when I've been like super focused on it and other times when I've not.

Shelby: 42:46

And then COVID times came and it really hit me hard, like we had a lot going on.

Shelby: 42:50

It was a lot of trauma in our home for a sustained period of time, and so I, you know, I was like not able to focus on that, which was really hard, and so then I was ready to get back into it and I connected with a woman that's, you know, a personal trainer and like a guru in my world, and you know she said like okay, let's start with let's. Basically, she said, you know, like let's get these habits going, and she said I want you to drink a gallon of water a day. And I was like, okay, and I have, like I have my paper, and I'm like, okay, like that's it. I'm like like what? Like no, I'm ready like I, I'm ready, like to do the thing. She's like nope, I just want you to do that for like two weeks or a week or whatever, and I'm like oh, like that was so hard for me, right, because I wanted to, like, I wanted the seven things and like that's so alcohol, like you know.

Shelby: 43:38

But, um, sometimes we just have to break it down into smaller pieces, right and just like. And also, it's really important for us to learn how to follow directions, whether it's in your program or a recovery program of any kind. We need to learn how to follow directions for other people Because, not because they're better than us or that we're not good enough or whatever, but because that's how we change. You know, when we learn to follow the directions of somebody that we've chosen to be our leader in our life in a certain area and, you know, a lot of times we want to take our will back and be in control and, like you know, but usually it doesn't.

Jenn: 44:11

I know. Thank you so much for your time.

Shelby: 44:14

I really appreciate your story. I love the work you're doing, so if people do want to reach out to you or connect, where do you like people to do that?

Jenn: 44:29

I love to hang out on Instagram and I'm at Jen Lee Hurst, or you can go to my website at joinlighthousesobrietycom where I have my a hundred day sober journal that you can check out, and then links to membership and my coaching programs.

Shelby: 44:36

Perfect. Let me show their link in the show notes below. And again, thank you so much for your time and I hope our paths cross again soon.

Jenn: 44:43

Awesome Me too. Thanks for having me on.

Shelby: 44:50

Thank you for joining me for this week's episode of Confident Sober Women. If you enjoyed this conversation, hit the subscribe button above so you won't miss any upcoming episodes. And hey, if you really loved it, leave me a review episodes. And hey, if you really loved it, leave me a review. You can learn more about the sober freedom inner circle membership at wwwshelbyjohncoachingcom. Forward slash inner circle. See you next time.